Honda Express spark! then no spark =[

[DoubleAey]

hey guys, so ive been working on a honda express i got from a fellow member here.

im basically all done. it didnt have spark, but i cleaned the points, and then tried again and got spark! but then the spark went away. i had a few sparks then it went away. no more sparking. Now i dont know what key position the key is in when i try, but i try all of them. (the key is missing so i just turn the key with a screwdriver. one of the choices lights up my tail light. (my headlight is dead) what could the problem be? i bought a new point, but it was the wrong honda one they sent me, but i tried it anyways, but same result. am i supposed to be holding a brake to get spark? or something special maybe? it sparked just by turning the flywheel, but now theres nothing. ive checked the wiring. Is the coil/condensor maybe bad? any help to get this thing going would be GREATLY DEEPLY APPRECIATED =[

[martynkim]

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[martynkim]

Are you winding the starter and pulling the left brake to start?

[martynkim]

Oh please disconnect the headlight BEFORE you try to start it will blow if you do not have a charged battery!

[odinxxix]

check your coil wires could be a broken wire causeing an interminent short. and are you pulling the brake handle?

[DoubleAey]

The green wire next to the carb is grounded and connected well, I just took it off and put it back on.

The express has a charge battery. The taillight goes on when I turn the key to the fort position I think it is. The headlight had been burned out.

The wirig looks alright, I havnt touched them and they arnt brittle. I've looked at connections, seems like everythigs connected.

My kick start doesn't wind up. It's just a kick start, unless it's broken. I don't pull the brake either. I don't think the light connection to that works? I pull the brake and it stops the bike but the taillight doesn't brighten. Do I need to be holding the brake? I had spark even when I wasn't holding the brake.

Are the points still okay?

Thanks guys for your help so far!

[wikked_spree57]

Those Express bikes can be a royal pain when they lose spark. Check the spark plug wire itself, your coil should be under the seat and the wire runs all the way down the frame rail to the motor.

You may want to check the spark plug boot on the coil as well. Yank one from one of your other Honda's that run and see if you get spark back. All it takes is a hairline crack internally in these boots and viola... no spark.

Just some suggestions. If you replaced the points and they fit, that's obviously not your problem.

Shoot your kill switch with QD Electro Contact Cleaner and flip it back and forth several times also. These are just like Sprees - the wiring on the inside of the kill switch housing comes unsoldered, and if that be the case it will ground itself out. Take the kill switch housing off and inspect the wiring on the bottom of the switch..

By the way, yes your kick start is supposed to "wind up" about 3-4 kicks, then you pull the left brake lever and it turns it over for a couple seconds just like electric start. It won't wind up while it's off the bike, though.

Hope this helps!

[martynkim]

My kick start doesn't wind up. It's just a kick start, unless it's broken. I don't pull the brake either. I don't think the light connection to that works? I pull the brake and it stops the bike but the taillight doesn't brighten. Do I need to be holding the brake? I had spark even when I wasn't holding the brake.


Your kick start should wind if it does not the spring is broken. Check your coil, rectifier, spark plug. Get your self a Clymer manual. An express is very basic but quite evil little bike as i have found. not all of my issues have yet to be worked out. Honestly, If the opprotunity arises I will part with mine. very qwirky bike.

[DoubleAey]

Thanks! Maybe the spark plug wire is cracker somewhere? I have a new ngk boot on the wire, but no luck. I thought maybe that was my problem too. I'll also check the kill switch. Tht might be my problem too. The new points I had bought didn't fit. So I'm going to have to find a new one tht does. I don't think my old ones are good. The contacts are pretty worn.

And I don't necessarily NEED that wind up do I? When I kick it, it kicks the bike over atleast two rotations, enough to start it. But the brake doesn't mean anything when starting right? Like when using a spree's electric start feature.

[mousewheels]

But the brake doesn't mean anything when starting right? Like when using a spree's electric start feature.

I looked at the wiring diagram for the NC50 (online at http://www.mopedriders.org/html/manuals ... resssm.htm) see section 27-01. There's no brake interaction with starting or the ignition.

Only the ignition switch and kill switch can kill spark output.

Re: old points - you might have done all this already - clean up the point contact surfaces with a thin file, then install and reset the gap (section 8-4 of the linline manual).

[martynkim]

If you find that you have a fault in any of your parts let me know I may have it I have a parts bike.

[DoubleAey]

I'll file down the points till they're nice and flat and contacts are hella clean. Good to know the brake doesn't matter.

Yeah I might have to hit you up for some parts maybe. Like a new coil/condensor/ plug wire (since they're all together) and possibly a contact point. Id it just d*** cheaper, I'll just buy those parts and know my stuffs good and not faulty. lol

email me if you got those parts and how much you might want for them.

Thanks you guys

[martynkim]

Never mind I retract my statement

[DoubleAey]

Hey guys, so I actually went through and checked my wiring and get. Seems my points, coil, spark plug wire and boot are all functioning perfectly. There must be something shorting out my connection. I was wondering, is there a way to hardwire this express. There's three wires that come out of the engine, the black I know goes to the coil, what do I do with the other 2, and what do I do with the coil wires? I wanna see if I can get spark bypassing all the electrics and just straight hardwire it.

[mousewheels]

I was wondering, is there a way to hardwire this express. There's three wires that come out of the engine, the black I know goes to the coil, what do I do with the other 2, and what do I do with the coil wires? I wanna see if I can get spark bypassing all the electrics and just straight hardwire it.

Ok - back to wiring diagram for the NC50 (online at http://www.mopedriders.org/html/manuals ... resssm.htm) see section 27-01.

Black with White Stripe is to coil
Yellow goes to the headlight switch
White to the Anode end (Fat arrow end of the diode symbol) of the Rectifier
Green wire should be to ground

For the Ignition coil,
edit: Black/White stripe to the points
Green wire to ground.

BTW - if you hardwire the ignition, you might leave a pigtail wire from the Black/White wire handy. By grounding it you can kill the engine.

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Coils are pretty generic on that age honda (find any) not to mention ANY 6 volt coil will work. Not trying to talk you out of buying parts from me but, I do have 2 working 6 volt coils. One from a nc50 and the other which I run one of these on my express is one from a QT50 yamahopper.

Interesting about he QT50 part. But I'm not sure which coil you mean. the ignition coil has no ties to the 6v system. Are you talking about the alternator lighting/charge coil?