'85 Spree still doesn't want to start

[bobbygerard]

Try the cdi

[patthesoundguy]

Yeah dont give up my friend its worth fixing.we just have to find your issue thats all. It might be worth pulling the carb off and looking down the intake with a flashlight and checking the condition of the reeds. Stop using the starting fluid in would be a good idea as well it can make things worse. Try using fuel oil mix instead. I have never had any luck with starting fluid anyway. If it won't run on standard fuel its broke. I find if I prime with 2 stroke mix in the cylinder thought the spark plug hole and it runs briefly but nicely then great its prob just not getting fuel and then I look to the carb and fuel system. If it doesnt give me a good solid "vroom" I dig deeper starting with the spark plug. I use my small engine spark tester to verify there is fire and it's solid by opening the gap up a whole ton a little at a time see how far I can take it. Next I may try a known working plug or a new one see what happens. I have had so many issues with spark on on lot of machines I go to fire first and usually its no fuel or no spark or both. But as I have learned through experience and much cursing and swearing over the years... When in the least bit of doubt check the compression. Two summers ago I was at the outdoor music festival in the morning my golf cart was running I left for the day and when I came back later it wouldn't go. I spent a couple hours thinking it was the same old debris blocking the fuel line it had been plagued with many times before. If I had just walk to the van and grabbed the compeasion test or I would have saved hoursof frustration. When I finally gave up on it I finally checked the compression... It had zero compression. It can only take a split second for a motor to eat a reed or crack off the rings and still turnover fine but not run. If the compression is good I would look to a sheared flywheel key after checking everything else. Hope this helps some

[Tombo]

Ordered the CDI on eBay today for about $12. The dealer quoted me over $140 before telling me it is discontinued. I know it's not a Honda part, but still... LOL Since the bystarter was only about 8 bucks, I ordered it too. Total = $20.75 with free shipping.

Pat, I want to to try those first since I know nothing about checking the compression, and I don't have the equipment...yet. I'm not ignoring your suggestions, just want to try the easy stuff first. I'm not a very experienced wrencher but am willing to give it a go with instruction.

I greatly appreciate all of the help from everyone.

BTW in my last post, no starter fluid was needed to get the hint of ignition. This is a step forward; the new (correct) spark plug made a difference. I don't intend to use the starting fluid again.

[bobbygerard]

Just careful some of cheap cdi will not last long

[patthesoundguy]

Dont worry if you need to check compression you can usually get a tester for free through a loan a tool program from your local auto parts shop. picking up a cdi and bystarter is a good idea. Then you can rule them out and if the originals aren't toast you'll have a spare for when then they do croak. I have a spare cdi and coil just in case. If you want to do the vacuum bystarter test in the manual you can use an ear syringe from the drug store for about 2$ if you have no luck with the new bystarter. You are making progress. Here's to hopefully popping in a new cdi and ripping away like mad

[Tombo]

CDI and bystarter came today. Put the CDI in and it started immediately. JOY! -short lived. It's bigger than the old one and doesn't fit the rubber sleeve, so I zip-tied it. It idled too slowly but didn't stall. Tried it several times to be sure, and it started and ran every time. Happily put the right panel back on and adjusted the idle half a turn. Tried to start it again and got the two second run before stalling again. Tried the idle all over the place and still get nothing. Kicking myself for not adjusting the idle while it was running.

Then I tried the new bystarter. NOPE. New one has a box type connector, and the old one has two cylinder type connectors. New one has the same yellow and green wires, so I clipped them and used some other connectors I had around. Hardly any hint of ignition now. Going to the store tomorrow to buy better connectors and will try both bystarters again.

Please give me an idea where to start with the idle. How many turns out in order to expect it to run before final adjustment?

[bobbygerard]

1.5 to 2 turns out

[Tombo]

Put good wire connectors in. Tried the new bystarter again-nothing. Tried the old one-nothing. Put some pre-mix down the air box and it started right away. Let it idle for a long time. It would rev up and down on its own periodically.

Took it for a ride and it did well. If it will go full speed even with my weight, do you still think it's a compression problem?

Ready to sell her. I need a faster scooter to survive these parts anyway.

[patthesoundguy]

Touch the bystarter terminals to the battery and see if the needle moves out should take a min or so to see it move. Checkng for 12volts woth a meter at the bysyarter terminals would be a good idea at this point. You must not be getting fuel to the pilot circuit in the carb. Thats the part of the carb responsible for starting and idling. Especially where its idling erraticly. You can have low compression and may still work just not very well and it will have no guts at all. The take off will be horrible. I think you have a carb issue and hard to say if you have a low compression untill you check it.

[Tombo]

What size fitting does the spree need for the compression test?

Are those new carbs $89-90 on ebay any good?

[patthesoundguy]

Sparkplug hole is 14mm. Most testors come with 14mm and adapter for The larger size hole. As for those new spree carbs I have only heard of one person trying it and I can't remember what the outcome was. If yours is clogged up that you can't get the pilot clear you might be better off getting a hold of a carb body or whole carb from someone here on the board that deals in the used spree parts. I'm working on a cheap carb replacement idea that is about 30$ for the carb and some type of adapter for it to fit the intake. Keep an eye out in the next few weeks. I have the carb on the bench and the adapter almost figured out. And I have the stock spree motor to try it on. I just need the new sensor for my cylinder head temp gauge to arrive so I can build the adapter and try the carb. The best carb for the job is the stock carb though.

[Tombo]

Sounds good. I'm still perplexed about my carb as it is very clean. Even poked a wire through every hole to be sure.

Compression check is next...

[patthesoundguy]

If you dont have the little hole in the float bowl clear that feeds pilot circuit clear it won't idle. Its the most common problem. Shine a flashlight down the hole behind it you should see light. Try hand choking the airbox inlets when cranking it over it will likely start even if the pilot circuit is not clear. And the compression test will really give you a good ideal as well.

[Tombo]

Compression tester arrived today. Before testing it, I decided to try to start her and to my amazement she fired right up and ran on her own. So I had to take her for a ride.

Did the compression test while it was hot. Got a hair under 103 psi. Normal?

Put the spark plug back in and of course it wouldn't start again in spite of being warmed up.

Checked voltage to bystarter at the plug end and only got 10+volts.

Checked the float bowl. You're right about that hole being clogged. I was always looking at the main carb body. The bowel always looked clean, but now I know to look at that tiny hole. Thanks. Couldn't get a wire through it, so I just bought some Berryman's carb soak. Tomorrow I'll fire up the air compressor when it's done soaking.

Still confused why it starts once in a while.......

[patthesoundguy]

There might be a little fuel seeping though just enough to start it. Soaking hopefully will soften the junk in that hole. A small piece of wire like a wire brush bristle can aid in clearing that little hole its around .30" if I remember right or there about. The trick Tobit is to poke and scrape then a little carb cleaner and then scrape with the carb cleaner in the hole and keep poking and scraping so the carb cleaner will soak in as you go deeper in the hole. If you can get your hands on an ultrasonic jewelry cleaner that might just get it cleaned after you soak it.