Having trouble finding gear and pulley replacement docs!

Elite-ist · Post by **Elite-ist** » Tue Sep 16, 2008 7:13 am

I'm gonna change my variator and to 9:1 gears and I can't find the tech docs on these subjects although I swear I have seen them before! Can someone point me in the right direction.

Dac · Post by **Dac** » Tue Sep 16, 2008 11:08 am

http://www.hondaspree.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=4513
this is how to check your rollers, but its also how you change your front pulley.

http://www.hondaspree.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=4489
and gears...

Elite-ist · Post by **Elite-ist** » Tue Sep 16, 2008 11:51 am

Thanks Dac you are the best!

Elite-ist · Post by **Elite-ist** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 8:09 pm

For anyone interested I've done the pulley and I'm halfway through the gears...

Dac · Post by **Dac** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 8:16 pm

hows it going so far?

PimpinSpree · Post by **PimpinSpree** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 9:51 pm

only tricky part is that you pretty much need an impact gun to get the nuts off the variator and clutch. That and my gasket was in a million pieces gunked to the aluminum. Other than that, its remove all the bolts holding the cover on, impact the clutch and and variator off, remove them, place a pan under the clutch area. Remove all the bolts you see holding the other cover on, grab onto the clutch shaft and jiggle it violently and then your in. Now spend 30 minutes scrapping old gasket off.

Elite-ist · Post by **Elite-ist** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 10:19 pm

Dac wrote:hows it going so far?

Good so far - I just drained the oil and gave my back wheel a coat of black rustolium - whoever designed that purple/black SR paint layout should be shot

Elite-ist · Post by **Elite-ist** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 10:22 pm

PimpinSpree wrote:only tricky part is that you pretty much need an impact gun to get the nuts off the variator and clutch. That and my gasket was in a million pieces gunked to the aluminum. Other than that, its remove all the bolts holding the cover on, impact the clutch and and variator off, remove them, place a pan under the clutch area. Remove all the bolts you see holding the other cover on, grab onto the clutch shaft and jiggle it violently and then your in. Now spend 30 minutes scrapping old gasket off.

Yeah unfortunately I don't have an impact gun - I had to improvise with breaker bars, c-clamps and screwdrivers jammed in places where they shouldn't be... also I hope i can salvage the old gasket - we'll see eh?

wilsoniya · Post by **wilsoniya** » Tue Sep 23, 2008 12:36 am

Elite-ist wrote:Yeah unfortunately I don't have an impact gun - I had to improvise with breaker bars, c-clamps and screwdrivers jammed in places where they shouldn't be... also I hope i can salvage the old gasket - we'll see eh?

I know many of these questions have been addressed, but here are some tips on tasks that seriously slowed me down when I was first learning. Some notes for posterity never hurt:

Do yourself a favor and buy an impact wrench if you can afford one. I bought an electric one from Autozone for around $50 that can deliver 260ft/lb which is a * of torque. The impact is useful for disassembly of the front drive (variator nut), clutch, and also removal of the rear wheel, which, if it's never been removed will require a TON of torque to loosen.
An impact wrench alone will not remove the clutch nut. You need to get a strap wrench. These are generally sold as oil filter wrenches at stores such as autozone. I bought one like this and it kicks *:

Just wrap that baby around the clutch bell to keep the clutch from spinning while you use an impact wrench.
Removal of the gear case cover will likely require a good beating with a rubber mallet. Be kind of careful so you don't bang up your dowels.
Find a big industrial machine shop to press off your old final gear and press on your new one. Tell them that you heard it will take between 10 and 20 tons to remove the final gear so they know to use a big hydraulic press and not waste their time. When I had my gears pressed, the dude didn't even want any cash because it took under 2 minutes. Its better to find a big machine shop b/c they have tons of cool-* equipment in there
***IMPORTANT*** When you put in your new gears, its highly likely that one of the thrust washers on the final gear will impede the free movement of your back wheel. This is bad. However, this may be somewhat expected given a difference in thickness of the OEM and AM final gear. I bought a 9:1 set from VT and after bolting on the gear case cover, the final shaft (shaft the wheel runs on) would not spin at all.. Luckily I found this helpful thread: http://www.hondaspree.net/phpBB2/viewto ... highlight=
It's highly unlikely you'll be able to salvage the gasket on your gear case. Mine got tore up into about 30 annoying pieces. Sadly, it's a pretty important gasket (for obvious reasons).
Don't be too discouraged if your hog doesn't perform very well after the gear swap. Mine actually lost acceleration AND top end after a swap. This all changed after I tweaked my roller weights. upping my weights from 7.5 to 9.0 grams gave a dramatic increase in top end (as well as a more predictable, less violent take-off (for better or worse)).
Refilling the gear case oil is a pain. Get a funnel with a hose (they look like mini beer bongs ), cut the spout down to size, jam the spout through the tiny oil hole and be patient. I found it helps if you tip your hog back ever so slightly so the oil hole is not perpendicular to the ground. I'm not sure if anyone has devised a less annoying way to do this. FWIW I used 10W-40 Quaker State b/c that's what the manual stated. People love talking about the weight of their gear case oil it seems.
You may want to tweak your center spring, but I know jack squat about that, so I'll just say it's probably worth reading about.

Elite-ist · Post by **Elite-ist** » Tue Sep 23, 2008 5:42 am

wilsoniya wrote:
Elite-ist wrote:Yeah unfortunately I don't have an impact gun - I had to improvise with breaker bars, c-clamps and screwdrivers jammed in places where they shouldn't be... also I hope i can salvage the old gasket - we'll see eh?
I know many of these questions have been addressed, but here are some tips on tasks that seriously slowed me down when I was first learning. Some notes for posterity never hurt:
Do yourself a favor and buy an impact wrench if you can afford one. I bought an electric one from Autozone for around $50 that can deliver 260ft/lb which is a * of torque. The impact is useful for disassembly of the front drive (variator nut), clutch, and also removal of the rear wheel, which, if it's never been removed will require a TON of torque to loosen.

An impact wrench alone will not remove the clutch nut. You need to get a strap wrench. These are generally sold as oil filter wrenches at stores such as autozone. I bought one like this and it kicks *:

Just wrap that baby around the clutch bell to keep the clutch from spinning while you use an impact wrench.

Removal of the gear case cover will likely require a good beating with a rubber mallet. Be kind of careful so you don't bang up your dowels.

Find a big industrial machine shop to press off your old final gear and press on your new one. Tell them that you heard it will take between 10 and 20 tons to remove the final gear so they know to use a big hydraulic press and not waste their time. When I had my gears pressed, the dude didn't even want any cash because it took under 2 minutes. Its better to find a big machine shop b/c they have tons of cool-* equipment in there

***IMPORTANT*** When you put in your new gears, its highly likely that one of the thrust washers on the final gear will impede the free movement of your back wheel. This is bad. However, this may be somewhat expected given a difference in thickness of the OEM and AM final gear. I bought a 9:1 set from VT and after bolting on the gear case cover, the final shaft (shaft the wheel runs on) would not spin at all.. Luckily I found this helpful thread: http://www.hondaspree.net/phpBB2/viewto ... highlight=

It's highly unlikely you'll be able to salvage the gasket on your gear case. Mine got tore up into about 30 annoying pieces. Sadly, it's a pretty important gasket (for obvious reasons).

Don't be too discouraged if your hog doesn't perform very well after the gear swap. Mine actually lost acceleration AND top end after a swap. This all changed after I tweaked my roller weights. upping my weights from 7.5 to 9.0 grams gave a dramatic increase in top end (as well as a more predictable, less violent take-off (for better or worse)).

Refilling the gear case oil is a pain. Get a funnel with a hose (they look like mini beer bongs ), cut the spout down to size, jam the spout through the tiny oil hole and be patient. I found it helps if you tip your hog back ever so slightly so the oil hole is not perpendicular to the ground. I'm not sure if anyone has devised a less annoying way to do this. FWIW I used 10W-40 Quaker State b/c that's what the manual stated. People love talking about the weight of their gear case oil it seems.

You may want to tweak your center spring, but I know jack squat about that, so I'll just say it's probably worth reading about.

Good info there - my aftermarket gears are thinner and less beefy than my stock ones is this normal or did I get bad quality parts?

wilsoniya · Post by **wilsoniya** » Tue Sep 23, 2008 3:59 pm

Elite-ist wrote:Good info there - my aftermarket gears are thinner and less beefy than my stock ones is this normal or did I get bad quality parts?

It's hard to say. Do you mean the gear itself is thinner, or the teeth? My gear thickness seemed comparable. The stock gear in my dio was a spur type (aka radial or straight cut) whereas the aftermarket parts were helical (aka slanted or diagonal).

I will say that my replacement gears seemed to be of a lower machining quality than the OEM honda gears. There were some slight burrs and imperfections compared to the OEM gears which looked *perfect* when I pulled them out. Then again, it could be that the OEM gears simply had any imperfections worn down after being run and bathed in oil for 5k miles.

I can't say for certain, but I shouldn't think it would be a problem if your AM final gear was a little thinner than the stock final gear, assuming everything was pressed on properly. Your mileage may vary (pun intended).

MotorMaker · Post by **MotorMaker** » Wed Sep 24, 2008 3:39 am

Ok fellas
I just got done changing my transmission gears. It is 1:45 in the morning. I ordered my gears and high-speed pulley from VT cycles in HI. It was $111 shipped ($50 for gears $50 for pulley and $11 for shipping to Indiana.) I installed the pulley Monday night it took 20 min and gained me 5 mph. The top speed on my 99 Elite SR went from 31-32 up to 36-37.

(keep in mind I weigh over #300)

( I know, I know, I weigh more than twice the wet weight of the scooter ) It is just so fun to ride I can't leave it alone. I ride 11 miles each way to work.(all country roads at wide open throttle

) I spoke to the guy at VT cycles on the phone He recommended 10 to 1 gears. But the closest set they had was 9.8 to 1 so I ordered them. Quick shippers at VT I ordered by phone on Friday and received it on Saturday (6 day shipping From Hawaii isn├óÔé¼Ôäót bad at all) I used a cheap air impact from the traveling tool sale.(Cummings tool sale I think) The rear wheel nut,the pulley nut, and the clutch nut came off with no pry bar ,or special tool, or strap wrench, or anything like that. I pressed off the stock gear with my 12-ton hydraulic pipe bender. I pressed on the new gear with an aluminum block and a BFH. When I bolted down the gear case cover the rear wheel would still turn but it was very tight. It felt like someone was riding the brake when I would spin the wheel. I opened the case and removed the offending washer. While I had it open I measured the gears and sure enough the new gear was .020 (twenty thousandths of an inch) wider than stock. I salvaged the gasket with only one small tear and I used copper high temp rtv gasket-maker to reinstall it. No reason to buy $50 gears and cheap out on rtv to keep the oil in. I used 80cc of 10w40 and 10cc of Lucas oil stabilizer in the gear case. The Lucas makes the oil stickier so it clings better. I used a 2-cycle oil-measuring syringe to get the oil in through the little fill hole. I think that is easier than the funnel and hose method. I have had my scooter for a month now and you guys have taught me alot. I got my SR for $50 with 2200 miles on the clock. Every body panel on the whole bike was either busted to He!! or gone all together. But she runs like a champ. Tomorrow I will reinstall the bucket and seat and try it out. I'll keep you posted...

wilsoniya · Post by **wilsoniya** » Wed Sep 24, 2008 4:37 am

MotorMaker wrote:Ok fellas
I just got done changing my transmission gears. It is 1:45 in the morning. I ordered my gears and high-speed pulley from VT cycles in HI. It was $111 shipped ($50 for gears $50 for pulley and $11 for shipping to Indiana.) I installed the pulley Monday night it took 20 min and gained me 5 mph. The top speed on my 99 Elite SR went from 31-32 up to 36-37. (keep in mind I weigh over #300) ( I know, I know, I weigh more than twice the wet weight of the scooter ) It is just so fun to ride I can't leave it alone. I ride 11 miles each way to work.(all country roads at wide open throttle ) I spoke to the guy at VT cycles on the phone He recommended 10 to 1 gears. But the closest set they had was 9.8 to 1 so I ordered them. Quick shippers at VT I ordered by phone on Friday and received it on Saturday (6 day shipping From Hawaii isn├óÔé¼Ôäót bad at all) I used a cheap air impact from the traveling tool sale.(Cummings tool sale I think) The rear wheel nut,the pulley nut, and the clutch nut came off with no pry bar ,or special tool, or strap wrench, or anything like that. I pressed off the stock gear with my 12-ton hydraulic pipe bender. I pressed on the new gear with an aluminum block and a BFH. When I bolted down the gear case cover the rear wheel would still turn but it was very tight. It felt like someone was riding the brake when I would spin the wheel. I opened the case and removed the offending washer. While I had it open I measured the gears and sure enough the new gear was .020 (twenty thousandths of an inch) wider than stock. I salvaged the gasket with only one small tear and I used copper high temp rtv gasket-maker to reinstall it. No reason to buy $50 gears and cheap out on rtv to keep the oil in. I used 80cc of 10w40 and 10cc of Lucas oil stabilizer in the gear case. The Lucas makes the oil stickier so it clings better. I used a 2-cycle oil-measuring syringe to get the oil in through the little fill hole. I think that is easier than the funnel and hose method. I have had my scooter for a month now and you guys have taught me alot. I got my SR for $50 with 2200 miles on the clock. Every body panel on the whole bike was either busted to He!! or gone all together. But she runs like a champ. Tomorrow I will reinstall the bucket and seat and try it out. I'll keep you posted...

Thanks for the info, guy--good stuff. Your oil syringe sounds like a way better idea than the funnel beer bong hack I used.. I'll have to get me one of them. Do you have a good way of draining the oil without removing the gear case cover and screwing up the gasket? Or is it just a fact of scooter life that changing the oil requires a new gasket? $50 for an SR??!

That's a steal!! Who cares if all the panels are busted. *, all my panels are cracked up and I paid way more, and for an S, not an SR. Do you have an assortment of roller weights to use to tune your vari? I'll be interested in hearing what kind of performance you get from that beast post gear swap.

MotorMaker · Post by **MotorMaker** » Wed Sep 24, 2008 10:25 am

Yes FIFTY dollars. A friend of mine bought it at 1600miles. And I know the guy who bought it at 1000 miles (the body was in the same condition as now at 1000 miles.) Head light plastic destroyed, all body panels gone floor plastic broken, brake handles broken off or bent, stripped screw heads and smeared nuts all over ,hole in the seat. The rear wheel nut is horrid I had to tap down the smears with a hammer to get the socket on. The turn signals were gone off of all 4 corners. On the up side the Head, tail and brake light work and the torque off the line is (was) crazy. The throttle sticks a little because the electrical tape that holds the head light plastic on pinches the cable a little bit. The rear clutch cover is cracked also. I only have the rollers that came with the new pulley. I have 2 sets of stock rollers but they are all flat spotted. I will get back to you guys later today. I gotta take the kids to school. Later MM

MotorMaker · Post by **MotorMaker** » Fri Sep 26, 2008 9:18 pm

See results here

http://www.hondaspree.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=7203