ram air? or not?

maddog · Post by **maddog** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 2:35 am

HIGH SPEED COOLING FAN, never out think honda engineers!

Dac · Post by **Dac** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 8:19 am

maddog wrote:HIGH SPEED COOLING FAN, never out think honda engineers!

Go away maddog. You are useless.

Now, back to topic. The motors idle temp is way down. the motors moving temp is way up.

Idle temp is so low, you could let your bike idle for days, till the tank runs out. And it will not over heat. But if you hold your bike WOT for a few hours the heat will be insanely hot. Damaging the motor.

I dont know about you, but the only time my bike really ideas for 5 mintues is if its cold out and im letting it warm up. I can stand to have the idle temp up some as long as the moving temp is down.

Do you understand what im saying?

mopedman · Post by **mopedman** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 2:57 pm

Dac wrote:
maddog wrote:HIGH SPEED COOLING FAN, never out think honda engineers!
Go away maddog. You are useless.

Now, back to topic. The motors idle temp is way down. the motors moving temp is way up.

Idle temp is so low, you could let your bike idle for days, till the tank runs out. And it will not over heat. But if you hold your bike WOT for a few hours the heat will be insanely hot. Damaging the motor.

I dont know about you, but the only time my bike really ideas for 5 mintues is if its cold out and im letting it warm up. I can stand to have the idle temp up some as long as the moving temp is down.

Do you understand what im saying?

yea i could agree with that

burnt_toast · Post by **burnt_toast** » Thu May 01, 2008 4:51 pm

Its true for most part, althought idle temp woudl be slightly higher theoretically it would not be a big thing.

For example my ministroked Corsa Elite's temp stays at 320-380F for most general riding, while idle temp usually drops to 280-300F. So you can tell there is plenty of room for a slightly hotter idle with the scoop.

But personally I would go with maddog on this one, bigger racing cooling fan would be more beneficial if on something besides dio type. stock dio type fan is badass and very large for cooling.

mopedman · Post by **mopedman** » Thu May 01, 2008 5:42 pm

yea but the hole point is to out think the honda guys

mosesdude7 · Post by **mosesdude7** » Tue Oct 28, 2008 6:02 am

You do know that on the Spree, Aero, and Elite, the cooling fan actually pulls air from up underneath the seat, around the cylinder and blows it OUT through the fan shroud on the side of the motor, right? That's why each of the two rear body panels has three little intake vents near the floor of the scooter (NB50). That's also why the fan shroud has a baffle on the FRONT of it. All you have to do is look that the direction of the fins on the fan to see this. So if you have a scoop that is supposed to be directing "high pressure air" INTO the black fan shroud on the right side of the scooter, it's either not doing anything or it's probably a good idea to remove it before it causes your motor to overheat.

Bear45-70 · Post by **Bear45-70** » Tue Oct 28, 2008 7:12 pm

Dac wrote:
burnt_toast wrote:And only at speed I might add, at idle you're actually letting less air in.

And if you're talking about ram air into intake, that is a pipe dream unless you are highly modded, even then draft air still works better.
you think?
seems to me that, it would help at speed. But at idea it wouldn't affect it.
I mean, the opening is still the same. It still allows the same amount of air though.
I guess if the fin was angled really strong (like some of the ones you buy) it would let less air. But if you make your own it shouldn't hurt it at all.

If the air is at a higher pressure, as a good ram air system will do, the more air enters the engine even if the carb is the stock one.

Dac · Post by **Dac** » Tue Oct 28, 2008 8:05 pm

Bear45-70 wrote:
Dac wrote:
burnt_toast wrote:And only at speed I might add, at idle you're actually letting less air in.

And if you're talking about ram air into intake, that is a pipe dream unless you are highly modded, even then draft air still works better.
you think?
seems to me that, it would help at speed. But at idea it wouldn't affect it.
I mean, the opening is still the same. It still allows the same amount of air though.
I guess if the fin was angled really strong (like some of the ones you buy) it would let less air. But if you make your own it shouldn't hurt it at all.
If the air is at a higher pressure, as a good ram air system will do, the more air enters the engine even if the carb is the stock one.

*

you do know this hole topic is about ram air cooling not ram air intake right?

EliteS120ccJDM · Post by **EliteS120ccJDM** » Tue Oct 28, 2008 8:53 pm

So wear do u buy these racing fans??

I mean..I never herd of them b4....I was thinking of modding my fan shroud as a type of rams air ...ill post up piks 2marr wen I do it...its a pretty neat idea

Chisholm · Post by **Chisholm** » Tue Oct 28, 2008 9:00 pm

I've always heard that Honda is excellent with thermodynamics. Ever seen the size of a Civic radiator?
Does anyone have an idea of the temp threshold before damage begins to occur (oil cooked, expansion, etc...)?

Bear45-70 · Post by **Bear45-70** » Wed Oct 29, 2008 1:07 am

Dac wrote:
Bear45-70 wrote:
Dac wrote: you think?
seems to me that, it would help at speed. But at idea it wouldn't affect it.
I mean, the opening is still the same. It still allows the same amount of air though.
I guess if the fin was angled really strong (like some of the ones you buy) it would let less air. But if you make your own it shouldn't hurt it at all.
If the air is at a higher pressure, as a good ram air system will do, the more air enters the engine even if the carb is the stock one.
*

you do know this hole topic is about ram air cooling not ram air intake right?

Yes, but I was responding to his statement about engine ram air.

"And if you're talking about ram air into intake, that is a pipe dream unless you are highly modded, even then draft air still works better."

He is totally wrong as it works very well on even stock motors. It was worth almost 1 mpg and a tenth of a second in the quarter mile with my old 1969 Ford Cobra wih 428CJ ram air.

The cooling system on almost all cars and trucks has ram air cooling to the radiator to make it cool better at higher speeds. Works the same way for an air cooled engine.

vinnie · Post by **vinnie** » Wed Oct 29, 2008 10:05 pm

mosesdude7 wrote:You do know that on the Spree, Aero, and Elite, the cooling fan actually pulls air from up underneath the seat, around the cylinder and blows it OUT through the fan shroud on the side of the motor, right? That's why each of the two rear body panels has three little intake vents near the floor of the scooter (NB50). That's also why the fan shroud has a baffle on the FRONT of it. All you have to do is look that the direction of the fins on the fan to see this. So if you have a scoop that is supposed to be directing "high pressure air" INTO the black fan shroud on the right side of the scooter, it's either not doing anything or it's probably a good idea to remove it before it causes your motor to overheat.

I just tested your theory with a bit of paper, and it is completely false. The paper stuck to the intake, didn't blow away.

It also doesn't make sense. Air taken in from the seat would heat up and try to rise again, fighting the flow coming in. You would have to FORCE hot air to go downwards, towards the side vent which would be stupid. I can't say that I've ever felt hot air blowing on my leg from that vent either, when standing beside my scoot when it's running. I don't know what fan you are running on yours, but it can't be doing much for the engine!

Does anyone have pics of their ram air system? I'd like to see what it looks like and how it works. I'd be interested in fitting one onto my Nifty Fifty.

Dac · Post by **Dac** » Wed Oct 29, 2008 10:33 pm

here is the only picture i have.

Kenny_McCormic · Post by **Kenny_McCormic** » Wed Oct 29, 2008 11:06 pm

Chisholm wrote:I've always heard that Honda is excellent with thermodynamics. Ever seen the size of a Civic radiator?
Does anyone have an idea of the temp threshold before damage begins to occur (oil cooked, expansion, etc...)?

About 400*f is meltdown.