no gas to carb

PC1228 · Post by **PC1228** » Sat Apr 25, 2009 6:26 pm

Hi all,

I bought an '85 spree last weekend and have been fixing it up. It would only start intermittently, and I usually had to use starter fluid, so I figured I'd clean out the carb.

So I took off the carb and cleaned everything and hooked it back up, and now when I crank it over it doesn't pull any gas through the fuel line (mine is clear). What went wrong?

**update: I sucked on the gas line and got gas out of the fuel line, so I hooked both back up to the carb and tried again. still no start, but my battery was getting weak, so I brought it inside for a charge. more soon.**

Thanks for any advice,
Polly.

Wheelman-111 · Post by **Wheelman-111** » Sat Apr 25, 2009 6:46 pm

Greetings

Carb doesn't pull gas, just gravity feeds.Screen lives behind petcock, the petcock itself, and the float needle in the carb bowl can block flow.

PC1228 · Post by **PC1228** » Sat Apr 25, 2009 7:58 pm

okay, after a charged up battery, still no start.

I took the fuel line off the carb and cranked it over - no fuel came out.

what does this mean? please help. I'm about to give up and sell this d*** scooter to somebody else.

Wheelman-111 · Post by **Wheelman-111** » Sat Apr 25, 2009 8:21 pm

Greetings:

A: Keep the fuel line off the carb and stick the end of it in a gas container. Pull vacuum (OK suck on the line...) on the smaller of the 2 fittings on the petcock, observe for a full-diameter gush of fuel - It should pour out of there. If so go to "D". If not continue with "2".

2. If not, then empty the fuel tank and then remove the petcock from the tank. Dig out the plastic screen - its flange will be just visible below the threaded tank fitting. See "3".

3: Examine that screen and cage for gum covering the normally lily-white super-fine mesh. You can soak it in solvent or spray it down with aerosol carb cleaner. IF there are holes in it, replace. Now reinstall and try "A" again. Better? If so, go to "D". If not check "5".

D. Make sure you have a tight-fitting, small-diameter line running from the vacuum nipple on the manifold to the petcock. Observe for fuel pouring from the line when you crank the engine almost as abundant as when you pulled on the vacuum line orally. If these steps corrected a problem, it should start. If not go to "6".

6. IF fuel is pouring from the fuel line when you crank the engine, then the problem is a stuck float needle valve in the carb bowl. Sometimes one carb cleaning fails to rectify this. On mine, dressing the needle bore with a Q-Tip and Colgate still didn't solve the issue reliably. I would at least do that along with another carb cleaning. Starts? If not go to "F".

F. this and sell the scooter.

PC1228 · Post by **PC1228** » Sat Apr 25, 2009 8:44 pm

thanks for sticking with me, Wheelman.

here's where I'm at:

fuel pours from fuel line when I suck on the vacuum line.
nothing pours from the fuel line when I crank the engine.

the thing is, it started and ran all day two days ago (with starter fluid, granted). this morning, it started on starter fluid, ran 5 seconds, and died. I took the carb off, cleaned it, and now no start at all. (and particularly, no fuel getting into the bowl!)

ugh. what do you think? step "F"?

Wheelman-111 · Post by **Wheelman-111** » Sat Apr 25, 2009 11:06 pm

Greetings:

Check the vac line for tightness. If OK pre- prime carb with as 10-sec pull on the line with fuel line connected to carb. It should start.

If it stalls quicker than a back-seat at your junior prom, re-clean carb, hone float needle bore, and install a NEW float needle. (even if yours looks OK)

If it won't start at all, check compression before and after 15 cc of GN-2 down the plug hole. Be sure to install a new plug after pouring oil in the Chamber. If both>80 check reed valves next.

If all that's OK and there's spark, it Must start.

Selling a Non-runner is costly and capitulative. You can win.

PC1228 · Post by **PC1228** » Sun Apr 26, 2009 12:59 am

Hi again,

Okay, n00b confession. When I took the carburetor off to clean it today, I couldn't get to the mounting bolts to remove them, so I disconnected the piece that connected the carb to the engine block. After looking more closely at the Spree manual (just now), I realized that what I opened up was the reed valve! I had removed the intake pipe, and the reeds were exposed. There was some rubber seal holding the intake pipe to the reed valve. It was extremely corroded and gummified - I really had to pry the intake pipe to get it off, and then there were strips of corroded rubber stuck to both pieces.

Did this corroded rubber used to be a gasket? And could this be the reason my carb isn't pulling fuel?

Not giving up yet...

Wheelman-111 · Post by **Wheelman-111** » Sun Apr 26, 2009 7:57 am

Greetings:

The carb still doesn't pull fuel. It's still gravity feed. However an intact reed block and gaskets is required to develop vacuum at the manifold. This is likely the reason the petcock flows with manual vacuum but not with engine vac - ain't none.

Honda can get the gaskets, even the reed block if there's a big gap between the block and petals. Clean up engine case, two sides of reed block, and manifold flange very well. Carefully scrape off all evidence of the old gasket, taking care not to gouge the aluminum mounting surfaces. A smear of grease to both gaskets prior to installation and they can be re-used indefinitely.

You didn't mention if it at least coughed with a manual vacuum carb prefill. IF so it should run once you restore vacuum. The correct tool to reach the carb mounting bolts is a long extension on a 1/4 8mm Socket. Wally World carries sets that are good enough for under $20.

bidroc · Post by **bidroc** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 10:52 am

I have the same problem as the thread starter. I have cleaned the carb at least 3 times. But I have not checked the reeds. That is next. When I suck on the vaccum fuel does come out. I have prefilled the carb before but after I hooked everything up, it still did not start. I am still working on it!

bradthreee · Post by **bradthreee** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 12:37 pm

Bidroc hopefully you blew the carb out with compressed air after cleaning. That really is the only way to thoroughly clean a carb.

Wheelman-111 · Post by **Wheelman-111** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 2:08 pm

Greetings:

Something evidently is preventing your engines from developing vacuum in the intake tract. Cylinder or crank seal issues and reedvalves are just about the only possibilities.

1. Compression test is easy to do, little disassembly required.
2. Next in order are the reeds; easier to dismantle than the cylinder head. Check those first.
3. If that doesn't give you the answer, the cylinder/piston seal is next on the agenda.
4. Finally if it's all good, the crank seals need evaluation. They usually fail due to a wobbly crankshaft. That usually results from mistreatment.

bidroc · Post by **bidroc** » Sat May 16, 2009 11:40 pm

I checked reed valves. there is no seperation or corrosion on the petals. They look clean and the hinge and flange, gaskets all look great. I need to clean out crank case but other than that its good. So I will test this soon.

What about the fuel tank? Is there a small filter right above where the petcock screws on?

Thanks for all your help.

Honda Spree and Elite 50 Forums

no gas to carb

no gas to carb

Pulling Gasoline

Petcocks and Nipples and Sucking, and I'm Not Talkin' Dirty

Step F

Vacuum-free