Honda Spree and Elite 50 Forums

zuphilius wrote:Looks like if I change the pipe I need to upjet to a 88 or 90. I need to get some jets from someplace before I change it out.

I tried all 6 gram sliders and didn't like the way it revved up and also the low top speed.

I work tomorrow so I don't think much is going to get done, Sunday and monday everything is closed. So I guess it doesn't get much work done over the next couple days.

Story of my life.

I would go with 8 g rollers and and 85 jet.

martynkim wrote:

zuphilius wrote:Looks like if I change the pipe I need to upjet to a 88 or 90. I need to get some jets from someplace before I change it out.

I tried all 6 gram sliders and didn't like the way it revved up and also the low top speed.

I work tomorrow so I don't think much is going to get done, Sunday and monday everything is closed. So I guess it doesn't get much work done over the next couple days.

Story of my life.

I would go with 8 g rollers and and 85 jet.

I have 8 grams in and it dont go to awful fast. I thought stock was 85? I'll have to look. if so, I'll put the pipe on Sunday or Monday and see whats what.

Got some time this morning to work on it.

First, stock pipe, all 6's, sliders. A little better off the line, level straight I get about 37, slows to 30 on slight incline.

Second, stock pipe, three 10's and three 9's. Still slow off the line, but gets to 37-38 on a level straight. Tops at 45 down incline.

Third, Leo Vince, three 9's and three 8's. Slow off the line, gets to 40, tops at 45 down incline. Cruises more like 33-35.

Fourth, Leo Vince, three 8's and three 7's. About the same as the previous.

Any other suggestions for where to go from here?

Gonna see about getting a 90 jet for the Leo, don't want to run too lean.

Also, what is the solution for the center stand vibrating on the Leo? Kind of irritating.

Metro wheel and up jet experiment

Metro wheel is out for now, I'm running 3.00's right now.

Going to check tomorrow for jets at my local Honda dealers.

Just hoping I'm in the ballpark for rollers.

zuphilius wrote:
Just hoping I'm in the ballpark for rollers.

i am still waiting for my jets....i feel like they will never get here but that is not why i am messaging you. i have the instructions from my nib leovince and guess what it came with rollers!

they recommend these rollers for there product on an engine with "unmodified engine and transmission units"

and they weight 6.2 grams

much lower than what i would have guessed.

Hi, I have not sourced any jets yet, I will probably just order some online, my local honda place is slow as molasses. In February. North of the Arctic Circle.

They also tell me they can only get up to an 88. I really need to do a plug chop to see if I'm lean or not with the pipe on. I know im bogging at takeoff but it revs up when I get above 15 or so. Also going to try the mixture screw settings Bear mentioned.

So today I turned in the mixture screw an 1/8 of a turn, put all 7.5 gram weights in and took it for a ride. I hold 25 up a hill, 30 up an incline, 36 on the flat, 47 full bore down a hill.

Problem being, there are not many flats in my area, well, I guess Seattle in general, so I need more speed or I'll be selling this one too. I don't want to dump a lot of money into this, red eft has the big bore and gears but that would run me about $300, which at this point I'm not ready to do.

I guess the next thing is to is A: Lose weight, 2: shave the head and up jet, or C: sell the scoot and just wait for a bigger bike to come along (which is my wife's thinking).

I will experiment a bit more before making a decision.

Any and all imput will be appreciated.

Greetings:

Don't forget 2B: Wear a Lycra bodysuit by Danskin. Just don't stop for a beer at the Certain Death Biker Bar on the way home from testing. Don't ax me how I know...

Wheelman-111 wrote:Greetings:

Don't forget 2B: Wear a Lycra bodysuit by Danskin. Just don't stop for a beer at the Certain Death Biker Bar on the way home from testing. Don't ax me how I know...

If I tried that, there would be swooning and purging of lunches a-plenty, thus with the diversion I could make my getaway.

Today was fun. I put the stock pipe back on and went for a ride. It seemed faster, I was still hitting 37+ on the flat, pushing 47+ on a hill, still at 25+ on a uphill, more up a slight slope.

Then I'm losing my front brakes, I'm hearing grinding when I stop. I tear it apart and one of my shoes had disintegrated. So I'm I the market for new brakes. Plus, one of the POs tightened the speedo cable screw so tight I have to go find my impact screwdriver to get it out.

My takeoff sucks, but I'm getting all I think the old girl has got top end wise.

So, I will either have to just deal with it, or bite the bullet and get gears and a BBK.

The malossi gears will make it even slower off the line.

So, lighter rollers might help takeoff, but will hurt top end.

Try sixes with the leo vince.

Greetings:

Lighter rollers = Better Take-off.
Heavier rollers = Better Top Speed.

Right?

Wrong, mostly.

The rollers, balanced by the spring out in the Driven Face, simply determine the Engine RPM during the transition from clutch engagement to top speed at a constant throttle setting.

If you go Too light, and your engine cannot produce the RPM necessary for those light rollers to overcome the spring tension, then yes your top speed will be limited because the belt drive isn't delivering the "overdrive" effect that occurs when the belt shifts all the way to the rim of the Drive Face.

But another way top speed can be limited is if the rollers are too heavy. This keeps the engine thrumming a few hundred RPM below its best power. As the groundspeed and associated wind drag rises, the engine simply can't produce enough power at this lower RPM, and so speed stabilizes well short of the engine's real best. (Unless you find a downhill or a gale-force tailwind...)

Think about going up a steep hill in your car: Floor it in 5th and not much happens. Drop into 3rd, however and you can accelerate. Too-heavy rollers keep it in 5th all the time.

Light Rollers Case in Point: I'm running 30-ish gram load in my vario and a +1200 Spring. My Giant BrandX vario sees the belt very near the edge, because the Corsa and PG pipe allow good torque all the way past 10.5K rpm. The wind drag catches up to the Mighty Polini at a best-to-date of 71.2 MPH. I need all of those 10K for that power to come on, and with 35 grams it dogs up to maybe 60 MPH.

On a stock build, stuffing in 5 gram rollers (with the same spring) will keep the engine in 1st gear for too long. It might leave the curb OK, but at full throttle a stock engine won't be able to exceed 8 or 9K RPM, and at that engine speed a Stock engine's torque falls off precipititously. In other words, acceleration after the initial launch will suck too.

It's all in matching the vario/spring rate to the RPM where your engine produces its best torque.