Honda Spree and Elite 50 Forums

Mystic wrote:It cant hurt if you have a bench grinder it will be really easy. put one of those wire brushes on it and brush the piston skirts where it seized, not up and down but side to side then a light hone on the cylinder to get rid of any aluminum that stuck to it. also it wouldnt hurt to make sure that any edges are chamfered on the piston and the ports with a small file. The worst that can happen is you sieze the bore again. I have done this before so i know it will work. Just for giggles I took the stock bore and piston that came with my af16 when i got it that only had like 60 compression and would not start at all. Did what I described and replaced one of the broken rings and it cranked right up

You never hone a cylinder with melted aluminum on it. The crap just destroys the hone and does not remove the aluminum from the cylinder.

http://hondaspree.net/wiki/index.php5?t ... ted_Piston

Those that do not know how to do it right should not give advise to anyone, including themselves.

Its whatever Bear, we all know you suggest to buy all new stuff and go strickly by the book. Reguardless of whether it is right or not it works, I have done this not only with 2 stroke but 4 strokes as well. Sometimes you gotta work with what you have

Mystic wrote:Its whatever Bear, we all know you suggest to buy all new stuff and go strickly by the book. Reguardless of whether it is right or not it works, I have done this not only with 2 stroke but 4 strokes as well. Sometimes you gotta work with what you have

True when it is broke, buy new because broke s*** never won anything, EVER!

Thats the thing some people just wanna ride not win any races or go broke in the process. I am not saying it will be perfect but it wont cost anything and give madman a little more experience with tuning etc without seizing a new bore or being out money uneccesarily. I am not saying my way is the right way but it will allow him to maybe use the bore instead of throwing it in the garbage

Mystic wrote:Thats the thing some people just wanna ride not win any races or go broke in the process. I am not saying it will be perfect but it wont cost anything and give madman a little more experience with tuning etc without seizing a new bore or being out money uneccesarily. I am not saying my way is the right way but it will allow him to maybe use the bore instead of throwing it in the garbage

It's call reliability and if you don't do it right, you don't have than and on top of the tuning is a b**** and it will be wrong when you fix it right. Amateurs.................

any luck with controlling temps?

I have same setup with ministroke and is running hot on pilot side 1/8 throttle 30mph 350+ degrees.

i also tried all different jets.

anyone know where i can get a leakdown tester?

kauaianman wrote:any luck with controlling temps?

I have same setup with ministroke and is running hot on pilot side 1/8 throttle 30mph 350+ degrees.

i also tried all different jets.

anyone know where i can get a leakdown tester?

It is not a pilot issue but a needle issue, raise in one notch.

Why do you think you need a leak down tester?

Ok to update I'm now running a 50mm kit from Taiwan (can't remember the name), with 21mm carb 45pilot and 118 main, all leakdown tested and heat cycled more than 7 times,(lost count at 7) still having problems with temps! Have never been to WOT 100psi compression.
Have not time to work on it this week but will jet to a 48 pilot to test! Hope!

Bear45-70 wrote:

kauaianman wrote:any luck with controlling temps?

I have same setup with ministroke and is running hot on pilot side 1/8 throttle 30mph 350+ degrees.

i also tried all different jets.

anyone know where i can get a leakdown tester?

It is not a pilot issue but a needle issue, raise in one notch.

Why do you think you need a leak down tester?

tried all richer needle settings after center. right now i am on the richest slot (last one on the bottom) and its still heating up.

I have the JJH needle that came stock with the 28OKO.

i was thinking leakdown tester to verify no intake leaks...

only thing i can think of is a leak i cant find or the crank bearings are bad.

when i check the plug it looks really black (super rich), wouldn't an intake leak cause a lean plug condition causing the heat??

the bike seems to run no matter what jets i put in the carb. also i can completely remove the fuel screw and the bike will still idle (no matter what jets are in there).

Are the cooling shrouds installed?

bakaracer wrote:keep in mind that on these bikes , its hard to get a really accurate plug chop since there is no clutch lever to pull in so when you kill the engine it stops right away.so the more the engine is turning the more the plug chop for wot will be not accurate.so the faster you can come to a stop safe the better the more accurate the plug read will be. plus you can tell also by feel and sound if the carb is to rich too so adjust jetting before doing a plug chop. again the jetting can be check with just a short ride down the street and back. no need for a 1 mile ride. if the bike is running crappy, dont waste a new plug on a plug chop. keep adjusting till it feels better then do a plug chop. if not your going to need a whole box of plugs.

I read on the wiki "From "Fred's Guide on How to Fix Your Moped,"
READING SPARK PLUGS and JETTING and PLUG CHOPS
Two stroke engines are sensitive to the level of heat inside the engine. The main jet size in the carb is the main determiner of how hot the engine runs at wide open throttle.
Too hot and they will seize the piston. Too cool means they are not making full power.
Engines get the hottest when they are running at wide open throttle making maximum HP.
"Reading" a spark plug is the best way to see how hot your engine is running. Reading the plug means looking at the ceramic insulator inside the plug and checking its color. The color will indicate the overall level of heat in the engine.
Reading the plug requires fully warming up the engine by running it for about 10 minutes... Then making a top speed full throttle run for a half mile or more, then killing the motor and stopping and pulling the spark plug on the spot. That is called.."Doing a plug chop".
When doing the "plug chop"... It is important to chop the throttle and turn the engine off with the switch or key and then pull over to stop... You don't want the engine to idle... that will change the plug color."

When it says chop the throttle, you mean you have it at WOT then let the throttle close all the way quickly, hit the kill switch and stop the scooter right?

Next question BAKA, you said if its running crappy, don't waste a new plug on a plug chop. Instead rejet and then do the plug chop. Are you implying you can only do 1 plug chop on a spark plug? As in, if you put it back in the motor and rejet, and you do a plug chop, you won't get an accurate color?

Actually that is at WOT only. No cooling shroud will make the thing run hot all the time once it warms up.

You can do a plug chop with any plug as often as you want, just run it a little longer to erase the previous markings.

yup all cooling shrouds in tact and good condition.

seems like when the bike is cold or warmed up only with ide i can find no leaks with the carb cleaner, but, when i ride it around (3+ miles) after it heats up, when i get home and check for leaks i get irratic idle when i spray the carb cleaner around the manifold area. (take in mine these are 10-15 second sprays with the carb cleaner and not just little bursts of sprays)

after riding it hot i pull the plug and it looks to be in great shape (nice cardboard brown color)

compression is 125.

i'm thinking about putting Hondabon on EVERYTHING.

i dont see how such a small leak could be causing soo much heat.

i figure if it was a nice leak a small burst of carb cleaner would find it for sure??