Honda Spree and Elite 50 Forums

read the "boggin thread" down a little ways but i dont think mine is reeds or possibly clogged,,because to make a long story short i just did a final drive rebuild to fix some worn out gears that was causing my annyoying loud racket..anyway engine/carb were running like a top before i tore off the corvers for the final drive. quick throttle response and pretty good overall top speed....so i get it put back together tonight after sittin for about a week and it takes a little to fire up but starts..then i let it warm up a bit go to give it gas and it bogs..no power almost dies but seems to keep runnin. no matter what adjustment made on the carb still does the same. i had a larger jet in it (85) because of a aftermarket airfilter and thought that was it, but went back to my original(82) and it does the same exact thing. everything worked perfectly fine before the rear end rebuild....any help or suggestions?? thanks so much

did you have the variator off?
i assume that the rear wheel spins freely by hand.
go through the carb and blow some air through all the orifices.

some stabs in the dark...

nope didnt have the variator off this time... last time before i redid the backend i put a new keli variator in and it helped acceleration/top speed alot..then this time i took the clutch off, and obviously the final drive cover to do the gears. but it has got to be in the carburetor,,i will try blowing some air through the carb and cleanin it again i guess. i believe the back wheel spins freely but i didnt check that. i cleaned the crap out of the brake shoes an inside the wheel. but once again im almost 100% positive its the carb some how. just seems wierd it ran awesome and peppy right before i ripped off the rear end.

Something in carb dis-logged (is that a word?) and got in pilot passage. Clean carb.

i cleaned the carb again. same thing happened. i just dont get it this thing ran pretty darn good before i redid the final drive gears. one thing that i didnt mention that might be it is the inside bolt that holds the carb on is stripped...it has been stripped since i first took it off..although now that i have taken the carb off a few times it is worse. it barely gets tight,,maybe not even tight. i dont know what to do though cuz i cant hold a nut on that back to screw on a different bolt. any ideas? im guessing this has got to be my prob. that sound right?? it is sucking air after the carb right in the motor??

You might have carb issues, particularly with your stripped mount bolt. You can rebuild stripped bolts with epoxy on the threads. Use a lubricant on the bolt before you screw it in. Let it cure for a day. If that doesnt work try tapping an oversize bolt. Many times you can switch from a metric bolt to an english sized bolt. Be sure to tap it first.

Raising the gearing will make your scoot more sluggish. Emphasizing weak spots in your powerband. Slightly heavier clutch springs might help.

I hope you are from BowlingGreen as KY jelly in green is gross.

just replaced with stock gears. so no change there. i guess its got to be that stripped bolt. just seems wierd tho. if its up on the stand it will idle and the rear wheel is turning some..never did this before i dont think. even at a basic idle. you give it some throttle on the stand and it will get through the bog and up in the power band,, on the ground it just bogggggsss but wont die really if you let off. if it was sucking alot of air right where the carb mounts does this sound like a symptom? drivin me nuts i thought i had it all dialed after the new gears! o and kygreen is for my name Kyle Green haha not any ky jelly

Greetings:

A loose carb mount is not a minor problem! This needs to be addressed before you attempt to run it. Even if it will idle, your engine's inhaling an extremely lean mixture. Add the effect of bumps in the road - remember the engine itself isn't suspended - and a seizure is almost a certainty.

One Cheap and Easy Fix:
See Harbor Freight Tools for a set of taps for under ten bucks. You'll need to drill the manifold and the insulator to 17/64ths. Then tap the carb flange on the stripped side to 1/4"x20 and use a 1.5 or a 2" standard SAE hex bolt or screw. Lighten up on your torque when you reassemble. You now know how easy it is to strip that aluminum flange. You only need enough tension to compress the insulator o-rings, whose tension "lock" the bolt.

Some will suggest Heli-Coils, but I don't recommend them in this application. They tend to spin out when you disassemble frequently. Another option is to through-bolt with a nut on the backside. Too fussy, especially on the Engine side of the carb.

Wheelman-111 wrote:Greetings:

A loose carb mount is not a minor problem! This needs to be addressed before you attempt to run it. Even if it will idle, your engine's inhaling an extremely lean mixture. Add the effect of bumps in the road - remember the engine itself isn't suspended - and a seizure is almost a certainty.

One Cheap and Easy Fix:
See Harbor Freight Tools for a set of taps for under ten bucks. You'll need to drill the manifold and the insulator to 17/64ths. Then tap the carb flange on the stripped side to 1/4"x20 and use a 1.5 or a 2" standard SAE hex bolt or screw. Lighten up on your torque when you reassemble. You now know how easy it is to strip that aluminum flange. You only need enough tension to compress the insulator o-rings, whose tension "lock" the bolt.

Some will suggest Heli-Coils, but I don't recommend them in this application. They tend to spin out when you disassemble frequently. Another option is to through-bolt with a nut on the backside. Too fussy, especially on the Engine side of the carb.

ya pretty much impossible to hold a nut on the back and tighten it. so i would like to tap it..drill out the manifold(motor side) and the plastic flange that goes between the carb and manifold..then tap the carb to 1/4x20..the part im confused about is you can use a 1.5 or 2 inch bolt in the tapped hole? just which ever? thanks. just dont want to mess this up

Greetings:

On the Aero, the far-side flange bolt was quite a bit longer than the outside one. I'm not sure which one you need, or if Sprees are different lengths. They're ten cents. Buy one of each.

The one thing to be extry-careful about is not to let the bolt end punch a hole in your carb bowl. I seem to recall having to chop an eighth inch off one of them to avoid this, but again, you may find the perfect length. The quarter-inch/20 TPI is a bit stronger than that M6, but try to contain your Super Kyle forearm muscles. A firm twist with a screwdriver is all you need. Torque value on this is probably in inch-pounds.

The carb bolts torque spec just surprised the * out of me. It is 7-9 FT/POUNDS, not inch/pounds like both Wheelman and I both suspected. That spec is with a cold motor, AKA below 95┬░ Fahrenheit

Greetings:

I shoulda looked it up, Bear.
Considering the far-more-substantial HEAD BOLTS specify 11 ft.-lbs, I have to conclude that one of the specs is simply incorrect in the HSM. Ah ain' puttin' no 9 pound on dem tings.

Wheelman-111 wrote:Greetings:

I shoulda looked it up, Bear.
Considering the far-more-substantial HEAD BOLTS specify 11 ft.-lbs, I have to conclude that one of the specs is simply incorrect in the HSM. Ah ain' puttin' no 9 pound on dem tings.

Oh, I agree 100%. That is more than I would apply. Besides a little Loc-Tite and it won't come loose by itself.

However the standard torque spec listed for a 6 millimeter bolt into aluminum is 5 to 8 foot/pounds by Handa-san. With a nut on the 6M bolt it is 6 to 9 foot/pounds.

Oh and the head bolt is spec-ed at 6 to 9 foot/pounds, or 8 to 12 Newton/Meters and the head/cylinder bolt is also a 6M.

All these specs are for a Spree.

cool ya on the elite the inside bolt is also longer like you were saying. im hoping by tappin that out and gettin it to snug tightly that will fix my bogg issue. im going to try to clean the carb one more time anyway since it will b off. i keep hearing about the pilot hole but after looking my carb over im going to b honest and say i dont know which one that is.. any help on which tiny hole that may be?? thanks you guys are awesome!

Greetings:

Look down that little brass tube on a moonless night with a bright light on the other side and your finger over the main jet tower. The ghostly apparition of that tiny pin-* of light will appear if the gods are pleased... Otherwise, clean (or better still, soak) that carb some more.