Honda Spree and Elite 50 Forums

Hello, i'm running the 44mm BBK and taz gears on my 86' spree. four one inch holes in the stock air box, oiled filter. I'm at the end stages of the break-in (3rd tank), running an 85 main jet, mixture screw 1 1/2 turns out. I have been using the oil injection plus 1.5 ounces of oil per gallon of gas in the tankWill I be better of just running the injection and straight gas? I have not done a plug chop yet, just trying to get things broken in. Scoot runs good, 20-25 on half to 3/4 throttle, idles nice and even. I'm using synthetic oil, if that means anything. Any input would be great, thanks.
Larry

Greetings:

The oil pump is designed to satisfy the needs of smaller 50cc intake fuel mixture "puffs". When you increase to 57cc, you added a 14% displacement increase, meaning that if the engine is getting oil exclusively from the pump, it will receive that 14% LESS than Honda-san ordained. Might be enough, might not. Mixing up some 100:1 premix in a 5-gallon can will ensure the deficit is addressed.

I would discourage you from adding directly to the fuel tank. You can't be precise without knowing exactly how much fuel is in there, and you may end up over-oiling. Too much oil results in a leaner air-fuel ratio, which can lead to overheating. If it gets too bad, the extra oil won't be much help.

Thanks for the input. The oil is not mixed in the tank, I have a gas can for that. How does the 85 jet sound?
Larry

76duece wrote:Hello, i'm running the 44mm BBK and taz gears on my 86' spree. four one inch holes in the stock air box, oiled filter. I'm at the end stages of the break-in (3rd tank), running an 85 main jet, mixture screw 1 1/2 turns out. I have been using the oil injection plus 1.5 ounces of oil per gallon of gas in the tankWill I be better of just running the injection and straight gas? I have not done a plug chop yet, just trying to get things broken in. Scoot runs good, 20-25 on half to 3/4 throttle, idles nice and even. I'm using synthetic oil, if that means anything. Any input would be great, thanks.
Larry

Where on earth did this 4 1 inch holes come from? Way to much opening. You are increasing the air demand by only 14%. Only 1 each 1" hole will more than quadruple the air in. Of course maybe everyone is think " If a couple of 1/2" holes is good then double that 1" holes is better." Not so, you want a tuned system or you loose power. * just punching out the second stock hole should more than meet the demands of a 14% CID increase since that doubles or is a 100% increase.

Hello,
I have 5 1/2" inch holes in the top of the airbox, toward the rear of the bike. I also run about 1.5 oz extra oil per tank of gas to compensate for the increase in cc's of the engine. I found that if I ran on the stock pump with no additionial oil in the fuel, that I would soft seize. I did that twice, and then followed the advice of fellow forum member odnix (sorry if I botched the spelling buddy), and went with the 1.5 oz extra per tank. Since then, no soft seize, and the plug chop gives me a nice cardboard color.

catsailor wrote:Hello,
I have 5 1/2" inch holes in the top of the airbox, toward the rear of the bike. I also run about 1.5 oz extra oil per tank of gas to compensate for the increase in cc's of the engine. I found that if I ran on the stock pump with no additionial oil in the fuel, that I would soft seize. I did that twice, and then followed the advice of fellow forum member odnix (sorry if I botched the spelling buddy), and went with the 1.5 oz extra per tank. Since then, no soft seize, and the plug chop gives me a nice cardboard color.

A soft seize is rarely caused by lack of oil but a lean fuel/air mixture. Lack of oil cause catastrophic failures. Adding oil to the tank will just make the lean condition worse without an increase in the main jet, which the engine needed in the first place.

The place on earth that holes came from is on the paperwork that came with the BBK. They are actually 7/8", but I don't feel there is much of a difference in this case. Catsailor, are you running 44mm or 48mm? I'll try covering a hole or two with a piece of tape for testing, see if that changes anything. Still wondering on the 85 jet.
Larry

76duece wrote:The place on earth that holes came from is on the paperwork that came with the BBK. They are actually 7/8", but I don't feel there is much of a difference in this case. Catsailor, are you running 44mm or 48mm? I'll try covering a hole or two with a piece of tape for testing, see if that changes anything. Still wondering on the 85 jet.
Larry

I see you follow instructions well and why would you think 1" is OK when it calls for 7/8"? If he found that 1" worked best, don't you think he would have said use 1". It also appears you have no math skills if you think 1" diameter is the same area as 7/8" diameter.

This guy loves smilies! Really, i'm not looking to get ridiculed about my math or instruction following skills, they are just fine. What I am looking to do is get a little insight on how the break-in proceedure I am doing sounds to the knowledgable guys in the forum. I would think by giving all the info I can on the scoots' current state of tune, and what I have done to it would give the guys here an idea as to wether or not I was doing something wrong and correct me. So don't break my balls, help, that's what this forum is(I hope) about.
Larry

76duece wrote:This guy loves smilies! Really, i'm not looking to get ridiculed about my math or instruction following skills, they are just fine. What I am looking to do is get a little insight on how the break-in proceedure I am doing sounds to the knowledgable guys in the forum. I would think by giving all the info I can on the scoots' current state of tune, and what I have done to it would give the guys here an idea as to wether or not I was doing something wrong and correct me. So don't break my balls, help, that's what this forum is(I hope) about.
Larry

And that is why your equipment will always be substandard with substandard performance. Of course you believe you know better. To stupid to learn from your own mistakes much less the mistakes of others. Oh and somebody needs to break your ball, as little as they are.

Greetings:

Wow, Bear. That's caustic even for you! Easy, Big Fellow.
I happen to think you're right about this one, but no need for the Flambe.

The thing you can't easily change on your carb is the tiny, cast-in Pilot circuit. Bumping up the Main jet is a step in the right direction, but decreasing the negative pressure upstream of the carb (big holes) works against an ideal mixture at lower RPM. Sometimes an acceptable compromise can be achieved with the air bleed screw (turn in for richer...) and moving the jet needle up in the holder so the Main comes online that much sooner.

Wheelman-111 wrote:Greetings:

Wow, Bear. That's caustic even for you! Easy, Big Fellow.
I happen to think you're right about this one, but no need for the Flambe.

The thing you can't easily change on your carb is the tiny, cast-in Pilot circuit. Bumping up the Main jet is a step in the right direction, but decreasing the negative pressure upstream of the carb (big holes) works against an ideal mixture at lower RPM. Sometimes an acceptable compromise can be achieved with the air bleed screw (turn in for richer...) and moving the jet needle up in the holder so the Main comes online that much sooner.

My tolerance level for "dumbass" is real low due to the continued rain.

buy a uni filter and tune your setup to match i have a 90 jet a uni filter with my 44mm kit and i have no problem not to mention a 43 mph spree so.... kill the air box get a good filter and up jet to match your setup.......

p.s. i know bear hates this but i run 24:1 premix no oil pump.....

I have the 44mm kit. I am running the 86 jet that Taz sent along taped to the top of the box. May switch to a 90 as fastplastic has suggested along with the uni filter. The setup as I have it along with 3.0 tires also give me 38 mph every day, and have been clocked by a cop doing 44.