87 elite 50 build questions

[Revolutionary]

I am building an 87 elite se50 af05 and have a few questions that I have not found answers to.

1) is there a company that makes an aftermarket forged piston for these already, for a known fact? I know that I can send my piston to have it scanned but am hoping there is an existing solution

2) who makes a top notch exhaust for these? I have seen pipes for everything but the 87 se50.

3) I have seen some CDI ignition boxes, but again, none of the listings I have seen list my scooter. Any suggestions?

4) has anyone built a sidecar for one of these or any pics available?

The short story is that there s an open record at the Bonneville salt flats for a 50cc bike with sidecar and production engine. Going there this August and thought I would try to make a good showing even though it is an open record. Any help is appreciated.

Btw, I found the thread on gear changing and it is a bit convoluted but will walk down that road as well.

[swimmingfree]

1 heres a stock piston the ring are wider then stock http://www.ebay.com/itm/Honda-Spree-NQ5 ... 7d&vxp=mtr
2 the pipe is a LEOVINCE SP3 PERFORMANCE EXHAUST HONDA ELITE SE50 SA50 AERO NB50 25% HP BOOST good luck finding one if you do please post were you have fond it...
3 the stock will be fine some of us say it dose not help bying the cheep ones on ebay
4 no!! if you do please post on how to and lots of photo ..

do some reading on here and it will help you get all you can get out of it .. thing you shood get racing VARIATOR. biger carb and manifold , taller tire 90/90/10, new crank bearing and seals ..
heres my build viewtopic.php?f=16&t=28131 not saying its the best but it shood help...
swimmingfree
ps
is it running now???

[Revolutionary]

Thanks for the info.

I did find that exhaust on eBid for $175 plus shipping. Went ahead and bought it. Hopefully the guy is ok. Never bought on eBid before. Looks like he sells a bunch of scooter parts on there shipping out of Hawaii.

I hve had the scooter about 4 years and it has always run great. Just tore it apart a couple weeks ago to get started.

I need to stretch the wheel base by almost 5 inches to meet the minimum wheelbase rules. I saw on here a guy that makes a 4" stretch kit, but I will just make my own or extend the frame to work.

I will take plenty of pics of the sidecar to post up here. Looks like a good forum with lots of helpful info!

[swimmingfree]

like a line to see the pipe ..
swimmingfree

[Revolutionary]

http://us.ebid.net/for-sale/leovince-sp ... 764572.htm

[bonesv]

Thanks for the info.

I did find that exhaust on eBid for $175 plus shipping. Went ahead and bought it. Hopefully the guy is ok. Never bought on eBid before. Looks like he sells a bunch of scooter parts on there shipping out of Hawaii.

Hey man, the guy is legit. A lot of us have bought from him. His name is Patrick.
http://us.ebid.net/perl/main.cgi?mo=use ... tle=daywot

Good score for your se50! You should up jet when using that pipe, maybe to a 85 or 90.
Go a bit larger jet if you ditch the stock air box and go to a pod style.

Be sure it doesn't leak when you install it. I always run it to check before buttoning it up.
Happy Trails!

[Revolutionary]

OK. I got some good and bad news. Bad news is that the record is not open, but is at 62.5mph. That will be a tough number to hit. I must remain under 50cc, so I need to pull out all the stops to get my speed up there.

The good news is that I can do anything to the engine/carb/exhaust I want and use any fuel or nitrous. So...

As mentioned before, I have the Leo Vince pipe on the way and also bought a variator from Patrick. Now I have some other questions.

1) what is the best carb recommendation for this combo?

2) has anyone here successfully run nitrous? (keep in mind that at 60mph I will need to hold the button for a full minute to clear the timed mile!!)

3) has anyone here successfully run a mix of nitromethane?

4) has anyone here successfully run alcohol?

5) Does anyone have a spare front wheel they would like to donate to this project? I need something for the sidecar.

BTW, frame for the side car is built. Not a traditional side car. Rules state a minimum size of 12" wide x 32" long so that is what it is, just a flat frame with a piece of diamond plate aluminum to kneel on. Reducing the frontal area and drag is a big deal. I will post some pics as it comes together in the next couple weeks.


side note: I owned and ran a performance automotive machine shop for over a decade, but never touched 2 stroke stuff. Making these things work is another thing entirely.

[Revolutionary]

Also,

6) what is best recommended gear for ~65mph?

7) what is max rpm for these things and still make power?

[Wheelman-111]

Greetings:

6) The gear thing won't be an issue. Contact RedEftPerformance for a set of Malossi 67-6458 16/32 teeth Primaries. The net gear ratio will be 7.83:1, not counting the variator "overdrive". The 65MPH thing, particularly with the little extra wind drag of the sidecar, will be harder to attain particularly at 49ccs. The AF05 crankcase isn't the most efficient design for flow.

7) A Malossi or Polini big-block seemed to like ~9500 RPM on my own builds, but those cylinders featured relatively mild porting. You may require more expertise than I can offer to get your 49cc engine to spin much faster. Read up all you can on port timing and matching exhaust to intended RPM range. Keep in mind the limited cooling effect of a fan-forced air cooling "system".

[Wheelman-111]

Greetings:

1) Carbs that fit the stock manifold are scarce. At one time a few years ago you could get Amal/Arreche-for Honda at ScooterCenter.com. If they still have them, I'd say 21 or 24mm would be ideal. If not, read up on fitting an adapter to the crankcase that will allow fitting an OKO 4-reed intake spigot, to which Keihin-clone OKO carbs can be mounted. Again, 24 or 21 mm should be ample.

2, 3, and 4)
I don't recall anyone posting up results with Nitrous, Nitromethane, or Alcohol. Obviously all tuning suggestions compared to pump gas would be out the window. If you raise compression as high as I suspect you'll need to in order to crack 65MPH, a trip to the county airport for some 100 Low Lead gasoline might be in order.

[Revolutionary]

Wheel,

Thanks. I will get hold of Red EFt for the gears.

I did some slight raising of the exhaust port and will work on the intake area. Fabbing up an intake adaptor is not a problem. I was reading about using a reed spacer. What is the story with that? put the reeds on top of spacer or under spacer to raise carb from reeds? This sounds like a good place to insert a small nitrous nozzle...Holly has a jet chart for 4,6,8 hp hit of nitrous for 2 strokes. little baby jets that look like I may have to drill myself.

[paulpauly7]

just use the reed cage and cut the centre out place reed cage on the block and the ct intake on top

[ped]

hi Revolutionary.
any rules on using a Honda 49.4cc af16 dio motor? with a polini corsa BBK, malossi crank, and other items. that will take you up to 65mph with side car no wind. like wheelman said talk to RedEftPerformance tell him what your doing. he can point you in the right direction. please post photos as you go thanks.

[Revolutionary]

Big bore and/or stroke will increase the cc beyond my 50cc limit

[paulpauly7]

your not going to do 65mph with a 50cc and still be rideable around town